Second Half of Treisman KIRO Interview, Now

Sarah in Olympia: Went on Denver Web site. I'm a teacher from Olympia. I can make $10,000 to $20,000 more a year if I taught there. There is a wide range of ways to pay teachers differently. I think teachers and unions are more open to this. Denver and Minneapolis have both looked at this. As teachers, we want to make kids successful. Time clock hours does not do that.

Uri: All over country ,when I meet with teacher leaders, I hear the same thing. If teachers are held accountable for student learning, you'll find that the public is more willing to pay them more.

Elaine on Olympia Peninsula: Attended state math championship in Blaine. 3000 students attended that. Out of 340 kids who won the top 15 placements, maybe 10 of them were white. The rest were Asian or East Indian. I think maybe they are hard wired.

Uri: I'm a big fan of olympiads. (Treisman said in an earlier question that no student or ethnicity is hard-wired to do well or poorly in math. It's all how it's taught) African American kids who take AP classes, do better in college than white kids who don't. Before the today, it was the Jews who made up most of winners. Immigrants, tend to gravitate to field of mathematics. But I think that it's irresponsible to allow  14 and 15 year old kids to take anything they want. It will have a profound affect on their future.

Ross: Make them take advanced math?

Uri: You bet.

Ross: What if they fail?

Uri: That's our responsibility. We need to ask ourselves how we can create systems so they'll succeed.

Ross: I've heard some African American kids don't want to take math,  for fear of looking white.

Uri: In schools, disfunctional schools, there is a failure to build healthy school norms. Large number of schools have no trace of that. In the Bellevue School District, large number of kids are taking these courses and succeeding at it.

Eric in Kirkland: My kids go to school in Colorado. It is true they were dissecting sheep brains in 3rd grade as class. They really are advanced. But there is a lot of pressure on them to do well and take these tests.

Ross: High stakes testing? What do you think of this?

Uri:  It's a blunt instrument wielded from a long distance. It can do damage, but it can also knock down walls that need to be broken down. In the best schools, most of the attention is on what kids need to learn. If they learn this, they will do well on test. Sometimes administrators overreact and focus on just the test. That is not healthy.

Ross: Math WASL and delay. What do you think of this?

Uri: If it's suspended for four or five years, all pressure in the hose will be reduced. The failure of almost half the kids in state on math WASL, that should be a wake up call. You need to look carefully  on what's taught and increase teacher ability. This is a failure of of system. But you shouldn't throw out the whole system. You need to make sure that kids are taking the math they need.

Ross: Do you believe in summer school?

Uri: I do believe in summer school. The solution is not, as some have proposed,  making the PhDs in  mathematics responsible for whole system. Last time we did that, got new math.